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Tuesday, December 05, 2006

MZone Exclusive: Bias Behind Harris Poll Revealed

(from MZone wire reports) Gainesville, FL -- College football fans were stunned to learn that Katherine Harris, the controversial former Florida Secretary of State who presided over her state's contested 2000 Presidential Election, is the "Harris" behind the Harris Interactive Poll, one of the three elements - along with the USA TODAY Coaches' Poll and the computer rankings - used to determine who plays in the national championship game.

Yesterday, her poll declared Florida #2, leapfrogging the University of Michigan, and sending the Gators to the championship game in Glendale, Arizona, to face Ohio State. But the MZone has learned Harris unilaterally certified her poll's results before anyone could question some of the irregular voting in the Harris Poll.

"I didn't need people asking stupid questions like who the fuck are the jokers in the Harris Poll and why do some ballots make no sense," said Harris when asked if she thought that was proper. "It's Florida and involves voting, so we'll do things how I damn well please."

Jokers indeed.

As first reported on Michigan Sports Center, some of the Harris Poll ballots left a lot of people scratching their heads such as these shown below:

Paul Zeise:
No. 1: Ohio State No. 2: Louisville No. 3: Florida No. 4: Michigan
Larry Keech:
No. 1: Ohio State No. 2: Boise State No. 3: Michigan No. 4: Wisconsin No. 5: Florida
Robert Lawless:
No. 1: Ohio State No. 2: Michigan No. 3: Wisconsin No. 4: Louisville No. 5: Florida
Ray Melick:
No. 1: Ohio State No. 2: Florida No. 3: Louisville No. 4: Michigan
Tim Neverett:
No. 1: Ohio State No. 2: Florida No. 3: USC No. 4: Michigan
Gene Ponti:
No. 1: Ohio State No. 2: Florida No. 3: LSU No. 4: Michigan
Jim Walden:
No. 1: FloridaNo. 2: Ohio StateNo. 3: Michigan

The individual ballot oddities came after Florida coach Urban Meyer had been on the campaign trail the last three weeks, begging for a spot in the title game. Sources told the MZone that Harris was - quote - "nearly moved to tears" when she heard Meyer's pleas that leaving the Gators out of the BCS championship would be the greatest injustice in recorded human history and could potentially add to global warming.

Asked if Meyer's intense lobbying and tearful appearance on the Oprah Winfrey Show influenced her actions or those of poll voters, Harris said, "We're talking about the BCS. It's supposed to make no sense and reward politicking."

When told about the true nature of the Harris Poll, Michigan head coach Lloyd Carr was stoic saying, "Well, that sure would explain a whole hell of a lot. In fact, it makes more sense than any other reason I've heard so far."

Anonymous said...

Jim Walden. Truly, WTF?

srudoff said...

That picture of the guy looking at the ballot with the top 3 teams seriously made me laugh more than anything I've seen on a blog site ever.

Thanks for that

Anonymous said...

Any ballot that didn't have OSU #1 and UM/Florida in some combination of #2 and #3 is bad enough, but it's obviously some voters further manipulated their ballots to intentionally screw over certain teams.

oldwestside said...

I think you could vote Boise State number 2 if you have the conviction that undefeated teams should get a shot, and you voted that way all along. You could also place Louisville in the discussion. Let's not get so high and mighty we can't reasonably include them.

Wisconsin at 3 or 4 over Florida (well, if they beat OSU maybe) is questionable as is LSU at 3 over Michigan.

What I want to see is how these votes changed and run the blogpoll analysis of them. I feel bad that these people will likely receive spam or be harassed at some point, but I dislike anonymous ranking

vulpesto said...

Did anybody else look at the Colley Matrix?

This "Bias Free" computer was the only one to rank FU ahead of tOSU. Being that they throw out the highest and the lowest computer score for each school, this poll didn't factor into the final BCS numbers for any of the top 3. A closer look also reveals their final strength of schedule numbers. Here's their top nine...

1. Stanford
2. Arizona
3. USC
5. California
6. Oregon
7. Washington
8. Oregon State
9. Florida

Bias free my ass!

QuitCryin said...

Quit complaining. A few of the voters ranked Florida #5, but you fail to mention that.

Here is a tip. If you want to go to the National Championship, beat Ohio State. You had a shot, and you blew. Your vaunted defense gave up over 500 yards. Is this system fair? No. Is Michigan better than Florida? Maybe, maybe not. All we do know is Ohio State is better than Michigan. Deal with it, and lose with dignity.

srudoff said...

amazingly, most computer rankings had the pac 10 all over the top 10 in SOS. not sure why but sagarin and the others did as well.

oldwestside said...

If you read the original post, those people who voted Florida 5 are mentioned and called out. It is not whining to point out the subjectivity of the BCS. It is bad enough at differentiating teams. It is another thing for people to change their votes for reasons other than play on the field. Maybe 20% of Florida fans would claim that voters realized Florida was number 2. Votes changed for other reasons. Those other reasons are valid for giving Florida a chance, but they are not valid for changing a vote. This has implications beyond this year and beyond Michigan and is a severe flaw.

Jerry Palm said...

don't forget, florida did play, played a top 10 team, and won. that in itself may have been enough justification for voters to vote them ahead of michigan. it's not like both teams were idle and UF got moved ahead. the other thing hurting michigan, in the last 5 weeks, they played crappy against ball state, beat indiana, lost to OSU and were idle 2 weeks. out of sight out of mind for some people i bet. plus they really hadn't beaten a good team in almost 2 months (10/14 against PSU).

it's hard for almost everyone here because we all have a vested passionate interest in the teams involved. most voters don't. how would you feel if OSU, Michigan and Florida were replaced with UCLA, Arizona and Louisville for instance? if this came down to 3 teams that i didn't care about, i'd be looking at things like quality wins, strength of schedule, best losses, etc and it would be alot easier to make a rational unbiased decision. but people in arizona, kentucky and LA would be bitching about my vote (hopefully not all 3 of them!)and saying that I'm trying to sway the final outcome.

vulpesto said...

How does that happen? When you throw out games against 1-AA schools, the Pac 10 has a 17-9 record against other conferences. That puts them way behind the SEC (33-7), the Big Ten (27-10), and even the Big East (26-8). What gives?

srudoff said...

i have no idea - it's a joke- i was actually calling out colley on another board for the pac 10 stuff until i looked at the other polls and found the same crap

for instance, sagarin has

1. stanford
2. USC
4. AZ
5. Wash
6. Cal
7. Oregon
8. Wash St
9. AZ St
10. Oregon St

is that fucking amazing or what

the entire pac 10 rated 1-10 in SOS

perhaps Yost and Bennie can contact him to find out why that is

Zach Landres-Schnur said...

louisville ahead of florida and michigan? do the voters actually watch the games?

Jones said...

Wow. Possibly your best work to date. Excellent pictures, and enjoyed perusing some of those final rankings. What does it take to become a voter in these things? A driver's license? $20? Two legs and a head? Amazing stuff. Anyway, nice work!

TitleIX said...

You have scooped the New York Times!
check out their take of the whole thing at http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/04/sports/ncaafootball/04colleges.html

you guys are hysterical

Anonymous said...

I'm disgusted. Man I was so mad last night I wanted to break shit. But, I calmed down, some what. Anyway, If USC wins Saturday night does anyone actually believe that Florida would have jumped Michigan in the final poll? Not hardly. This all came down to no re-match. And considering the NCG is supposed to be the best 2 teams in the nation, this is a travesty.

For the first time in my life I'm gonna cheer for tosu to crush Florida. How do I get a hat w/ BCS with a circle around it with a line through it? You folks should come up with one. I'd buy it.

dgarr22 said...

All bias aside you have to see that UF is a logical choice. They have the same record, won their conference, and had the hardest schedule in the country.

statprof said...

The conference SOS rankings aren't that big a mystery. Those *can't* be influenced by intraconference games at all. It's purely who you play out of conference. So, look at the intraconference games listed here:

Games against non-BCS:

B12 26/37 70.3%
SEC 25/40 62.5%
B10 23/37 62.2%
ACC 23/39 59.0%
BE 16/34 47.1%
P10 12/26 46.2%

While the SEC and Big 12 were feasting on tasty C-USA and Sun Belt treats, and the Big Ten was gorging itself on its MAC buffet, the Pac 10 was taking on BCS teams and a more reasonable diet of less embarassing WAC and MWC teams (Boise, BYU, Nevada, Hawaii, Utah).

[And what, again, is the *incontrovertible evidence* that Boise and Louisville don't belong somewhere in the 2-5 range? That ranking them there is ridiculous or scandalous? There isn't any. Put them on the field in a playoff.]

And Perles ranks Michigan #2 because ... he lives in Michigan?!?

The computers aren't flawless but at least they pay attention.

Anonymous said...

More proof the system is screwed up even more than the surface shows - Tressel's future ability to vote in the coaches poll will now be under review since he abstained this past ballot. Unbelievable. Apparently having class and ethics (Tressel...Carr not playing media politics) gets you nowhere.

Alex G. said...

You left out the best part. Catherine Harris' father is none other than Ben Hill Griffin, whose name adorns The Swamp!

Boomer Bear said...

I think that God finally took vengance on Michigan for you guys making fun of His Irish so much.... As for Florida, they will get beat by at least 20 to OSU and the argument will end up as meaningless as it did back in 2000 when OU beat FSU in the title game (although Miami should have been there). That's what Urban will get for standing up Notre Dame to take the Florida job.

Hoping my Freakin Irish actually win a bowl game this century,

"The Bear"

Steve said...

You had me going there for a bit, but since when does a Republican (Harris) care about global warming?

cc said...

Well, I've got Michigan playing Arkansas in the first round of my NCAA Playoffs. Wouldn't it be great to head into next week excited about the first round matchup? You can see brackets at http://ccexplore.pokerworks.com.

Anonymous said...

Is anyone else kind of annoyed with Carr's response to Tressel's APPROPRIATE AND CLASSY decision to abstain from the voting?

Carr continued his whining, calling it a "slick" move. Lloyd, abstaining was the right thing to do. Grow up!!!

srudoff said...

Actually statprof, we're talking about individual SOS rankings which DO take into account intradivision games.

That being said, no way the pac 10 should get all 10 spots in the sagarin sos rankings, except maybe stanford because they don't get the luxury of playing themselves!

surrounded in columbus said...

your buddy Colin Cowherd is wetting himself w/ glee this a.m. only talking head in the world not only pushing FLA as the right choice, but that the BCS "works fine" and requires no fixing.

in the end, that's my real angst. the BCS was supposed to remove the human politicking and create an objective #1 vs #2 game. they didn't. they didn't get FLA into the game because they were better than michigan. they did it to prevent a rematch/share the wealth from the final game/stop a big ten lock on the mnc.

FLA's a good team but i haven't heard anyone but FLA fans suggest that they'd beat michigan. they're already an 8+ pt dog against tosu (we were a 6.5 dog in Columbus).

the BCS didn't create the 1 v 2 match up that is its sole purpose. instead, the followed the old pre BCS formula and created the game "america wants to see"/no rematch/FLA or somebody else should get their turn @ tosu match up. but they didn't do this because people woke up sunday a.m. thinking FLA is the better team after two weeks of them being ranked behind michigan w/ us both having one loss.

and anybody who thinks otherwise, answer this- if USC had won saturday, do you really think FLA would still have moved ahead of us in the polls from 4th to 3rd? puleeze. this would have never come up but for USC's loss.

personally, i don't have a problem w/ FLA playing. they're deserving, as was USC (and us). and until we have a playoff, people will get "Auburned". this year it's our turn. but we did get jobbed. all the other discussion on merits is just window dressing.

and i don't have a problem w/ the bowls & conferences jockeying for position. i grew up w/ that system. but then, what do we need the bcs for?

crock said...

anyone know when the coaches poll ballots will be released? that should be interesting....

richard Cranium said...

How could someone vote Florida number one? Really? Eh fuck em this system is imperfect and a playoff will follow.
What if they put a playoff game into the Championship between the tied teams. Have Michigan and Florida settle it on the field. Then let the winner get owned by OSU!!!

beast in 'bama said...

Well said, SIC, well said.

It was clear to me in mid-October who the two best teams in the country were going to be this year - Ohio State and Michigan. I probably annoyed everyone on this site with that assertion, but the truth is the truth.

All I want to see in the BCS title game (if my favorite team is not in the running) - are the two best teams in the country playing for all the marbles. That is not what we are getting this year, and it's a damned shame.

It's good to see you boys are keeping your sense of humor. That's about all we've got left in these strange times.

trojan mike said...

Michigan got screwed

Kraut said...

Why the hell are we talking about global warming on a football site? It's not nearly as important an issue as who's playing in the BCS Championship Game ...

Kraut said...

For anyone who uses the, "Has to have won their conference argument," I have a hypothetical question for you ...

What if Arkansas had beat Florida on Saturday? Are you saying that Arkansas should have gone over Michigan? Or perhaps we should be looking at USC or Louisville over Michigan?

surrounded in columbus said...

thanks. if the BCS is supposed to create #1 vs #2, it should do just that. otherwise, we don't need the bcs at all.

the "conference champ" thing is just more smoke & mirrors. you don't hear anyone pitching Lousiville because they won theirs.

and while the Nebraska/OU prior appearances are cited as the "why" you should have to win your conference, they're so different as to be laughable. Neb/OU both got upset by lesser ranked teams, that pasted them by multiple TDs. both Neb/OU went on to play in the BCS game despite being torched in their conf championships.

Michigan finished second behind the team already playing in the BCS game. we didn't lose to a colorado or ksu by a ton. we lost to the #1 team by 3 pts, in cowtown.

btw- i'll give Urban a bit of credit. last night they asked him if he still thought the bcs was flawed, and he stuck to his previous answer that it needed reformed (though he hedged by not calling for a playoff). they also hit him w/ the clip of Lloyd's "inappropriate comments" statement. Urban said he had not seen it before, and while he didn't actually apologize, he did go out of his way to say "nice" things about both m & tosu.

he's still pretty smarmy, but i can't fault him for plugging his own self interest. it's the rest of the world buying it i question.

one last thought on rematches, i keep wondering how the BCS would react if instead of Michigan, the potential match up was tosu wisconsin? if the cheesers had beat michigan, what would the rest of the world do to prevent an all big ten final of undefeated teams that were co champs of their conference?

Anony said...

Once again Benny, great photoshop work.

surrounded in columbus said...

coaches ballots are out-

not as goofy as it could have been.

srudoff said...

2 things. A) If OSU or UM were conf champs and missed out of the title game to a 2nd place team, I'm pretty sure most Wolverine and Buckeye fans would be playing the conf champs card. Along the same lines, if one of us were #3 with one loss and the top 2 teams in the field had already played late in the season and were big rivals (say Nebraska and Oklahoma), I'm pretty sure many fans up here would be playing the rematch card as well. A good example is when it was Michigan against USC for #2. USC fans were touting their tough OOC schedule and UM fans were saying so what (at least on gbw). As soon as it became Florida, some UM fans were pointing out Florida's weak OOC schedule compared to Michigan's. My point is, it's all relative. We're all going to pick and choose our "ammo" based on how it affects our beloved teams. If Michigan were #3 behind #2 West Virginia or Louisville right now, you better believe Wolverine fans would be talking about Strength of Schedule til their faces turned blue. When it's Florida or USC, SOS takes a back seat to best loss. It's all relative. (and this isn't a knock on Michigan or their fans - it's human nature for all fans).

B)The question about would Florida have passed UM if USC would have won is an interesting one. I agree with Jerry Palm in that voters weren't forced to measure UM against UF until now. They measured UM vs USC and that's it. Now they are being forced to reevaluate their ballots. Of course some are voting to avoid a rematch. Unfortunately, that's their given right - there are no rules or regulations for voting that say you have to pick the two best schools with no extenuating circumstances coming into play.

crock said...

thanks for posting SIC

Anonymous said...

The coaches from these Universities selected Michigan as #2 according to the USA Today:

Ball State, Central Florida, Central Michigan, Connecticut,Indiana, Michigan, Michigan State, Northern Illinois, Notre Dame, Oregon, Oregon State, Purdue, Rutgers, TCU, Texas, Texas Tech, Troy, and Wyoming

statprof said...

No difference, really. The SOS for any one team is equivalent to the conference SOS plus or minus individual schedule idiosyncracies (on average the worst team in a round robin conference will be the highest, not having to play themselves). Generally, these will be highly correlated within conference, as in fact they are. The individual Pac10 teams are all high on SOS because the overall Pac10 OOC schedule was on average tougher.

Bottom line. SOS for a given team will be generated in large part by the SOS of its conference, which comes from the conference's out of conference scheduling.

Rankings for given teams will be correlated within conference, too. With whole conferences moving up because they play tough OOC competition (e.g., Pac10) and/or consistently beat the OOC competition they do play (e.g., Big East).

surrounded in columbus said...

oddly, i don't disagree w/ anything you said. i didn't want a rematch w/ tosu after we played in 2003 when folks thought usc would play OU in the sugar. i don't blame anyone not wanting one this year. and i'm very aware that if the polls had held up and we had been selected, the FLA fans would have been more outraged (or more whiney- hell, they're more whiney about being selected than we've been about not).

my point is that the bcs was supposed to eliminate the "politic" factor. all the points you make are subjective, human/emotional factors. winning your conference is NOT a bcs criteria. avoiding a rematch is NOT a bcs factor. preventing one conference from locking up the mnc before the game is NOT a bcs factor. giving the FLA/Auburns of the world "their shot" is NOT a bcs factor.

the sole purpose of the BCS is to create #1 vs #2. how many of these voters really think FLA is better than Michigan? certainly not Vegas. how about you? if FLA played Michigan on a neutral field, do you think they'd win?

the bcs continues to be a failure. not because it sent FLA instead of us. i happen to agree w/ most of the "political" arguments. it failed because it failed to follow its own formula/mandate to create 1 vs 2 and instead created "the game everyone in america wants to see".

when it came to a decision, the whole goal of matching 1 vs 2 went out the window and they reverted to the method of picking bowl opponents that we had before the bcs.

we had that before the bcs. we'd be better off going back to the old system (where the conferences had more sway individually) than what we've got now.

srudoff said...

Do I think UM would be UF on a neutral field? Yes. But do I think there SHOULD be a clause that you have to be a conference champion to play in the title game? Yes. What happened this year is rare enough that it shouldn't stop that clause from happening. There are conferences for a reason and conference championships and title games for a reason. This year there isn't that clause of course but I think that there are a lot of people, especially coaches, that feel that way and voted that way.

care to articulate how Arizona state's SOS is rated #9 by sagarin with THIS ooc schedule then...

N. Arizona, Nevada, Colorado, Hawaii

Anonymous said...

In '04, when the Big 12 commish was in charge of the BCS, Oklahoma got the nod over Auburn.

Now Florida gets the nod over Michigan while the SEC commish is in charge of the BCS.

I think Mike Slive, SEC commish, knows that if he left Florida out, the SEC university presidents would tell him to not let the door hit him where the Good Lord split him.

Just another reason to blow up the BCS.

Anonymous said...

Fucking USC. Why'd they have to go and make this huge ass mess?

srudoff said...

uhh yeah that is a coincidence

the person in charge of the BCS has NOTHING to do with the selection process once a season begins. do you think he called Harris poll voters or, even better, NCAA coaches and told them that the SEC was not missing out on his watch?

Anonymous said...

vulpesto -

Know you're a ways up, but just wanted to comment on your 'bias free my ass' comment about the Colley Matrix's SOS formula.

I am not surprised at all that 8 of the top 9 teams in the matrix are Pac-10 teams. The Pac-10 was the only conference that instead of allowing teams to schedule an additional 1-AA game as part of the '12th game' instead added an addiiotnal in-conference game.

Instead of playing an additional 1-AA team, all Pac-10 teams played an in-conference foe. Granted, playing a team like Stanford might not be considered very strong, but when compared to, say, Western Michigan or Western Carolina, that's going to inflate their SOS.

The primary reason the Pac-10 did this was to increase their BCS chances. Looks like that worked from the SOS perspective, but their teams beat up on each other a little bit.

I have no doubt that given the debacle this year, the Big-10 might give some serious thought to this as well.

Besides, who wouldn't have wanted Wisconsin to play Ohio State, or Michigan to play Purdue?

Look, I'm not saying the Pac-10 is the greatest conference this year, but they clearly have a pretty strong argument that there are 6-7 *good* teams in that conference. You can't necessarily say the same thing about the Big-10 or ACC this year, and to a lesser extent, the SEC.

Anonymous said...

vulpesto -

Know you're a ways up, but just wanted to comment on your 'bias free my ass' comment about the Colley Matrix's SOS formula.

I am not surprised at all that 8 of the top 9 teams in the matrix are Pac-10 teams. The Pac-10 was the only conference that instead of allowing teams to schedule an additional 1-AA game as part of the '12th game' instead added an addiiotnal in-conference game.

Instead of playing an additional 1-AA team, all Pac-10 teams played an in-conference foe. Granted, playing a team like Stanford might not be considered very strong, but when compared to, say, Western Michigan or Western Carolina, that's going to inflate their SOS.

The primary reason the Pac-10 did this was to increase their BCS chances. Looks like that worked from the SOS perspective, but their teams beat up on each other a little bit.

I have no doubt that given the debacle this year, the Big-10 might give some serious thought to this as well.

Besides, who wouldn't have wanted Wisconsin to play Ohio State, or Michigan to play Purdue?

Look, I'm not saying the Pac-10 is the greatest conference this year, but they clearly have a pretty strong argument that there are 6-7 *good* teams in that conference. You can't necessarily say the same thing about the Big-10 or ACC this year, and to a lesser extent, the SEC.

Anonymous said...

I can't believe FELLOW BIG TEN COACH Ron Zook voted the school who crucified him (FLA) over Michigan! What a fucking asshole. And when do we play Illinois!?

Anonymous said...

Funny post. On a side note, Michigan fans need to form a gigantic, males-only, clotheless pile and fuck each other into non-existence. "Alright everybody, were going back to the pile!"

surrounded in columbus said...

again, i agree that conf champ games could play a role in eliminating contenders, but it isn't a rule now.

from the BCS website:

The Bowl Championship Series (BCS) is a five-game arrangement for post-season college football that is designed to match the two top-rated teams in a national championship game and to create exciting and competitive matchups between eight other highly regarded teams in four other games.

this is supposed to be the bcs' primary function. that's not what they did. they let the human/political factors determine the bcs game, not an objective assessment of who's #2.

all the other factors you and others have raised would be fine w/ me, IF they were part of the formula. they're not.

as far lobbying, are you too young to remember the 1973 rose bowl selection w/ in the big ten? how about in '02 when the big ten & pac commissioners "leaned" on the bcs to make sure USC & Iowa both found a bowl game.

of course lobbying takes place. of course lobbying took place last weekend.

Anonymous said...

"As usual, this is Ron Bergundy signing off. Go fuck yourselves, Michigan."

srudoff said...

oh I'm sure the commissioner of the SEC leaned on his coaches to vote for florida, just like i'm sure the same happened in the big ten (apparently ron zook didn't get the memo). but to imply that it completely turned a decision that is 33% coaches, 33% harris poll voters and 33% computers is a little too Oliver Stone for me.

i do remember 73 vaguely (I was 7) - that was lobbying within the big ten though if i recall. and in 2002 it was lobbying bowl games, not voters. so a little different in both cases than lobbying actual voters.

WarEagleDan said...

As an Auburn fan I have this to say. Michigan fans will never really know the definition of "screwed" until they go undefeated and don't even get one chance to play for all of the marbles. If michigan is truely the second best team in the country then the national championship took place 2 weeks ago. Now its florida's turn to play.

That being said, I thnk that both florida and michigan are great teams. Its a shame we dont have a system where all of the good teams have a shot to play for the national championship. For example, Auburn is the only team to beat two BCS teams (Fla and LSU) but what bowl game does auburn end up going to... The cotton bowl of all places. The only two teams that Auburn lost too are now top 25 teams. USC on the other hand loses to two unranked teams and somehow still stays in front of Auburn. Bottom line, there needs to be some sort of playoff system and the USC/Pac-10 bias is getting out of hand. Thats all I've got.

Jim said...

Let's see, what's more questionable - picking your votes to make sure the BCS picks what team you honestly think deserves a title shot, or going offsides repeatedly & intentionally on a kickoff to burn the clock so the other team doesn't have a chance to come back on you.

A playoff system could still be subject to the "people factor", but at least the effect of the potential impact would be decreased.

Interesting list of coaches that voted Michigan #2- pretty regionalized except for Troy and Central Florida- two teams that freaking loathe the SEC for sure and two schools who's recruiting could be hurt by an SEC team in the title match.

I personally believe it reasonable that Michigan or Florida could both deserve to be ranked #2. It sucks they can't play for the chance on the field. What if they received identical BCS score? What's the tie-breaker decision for the last BCS of the season before bowls?

Anonymous said...

That's some nice, rational thought, Wareagledan. Nobody will ever be screwed more than Auburn 04. They went fucking undefeated...and had Cadillac Williams and Ronnie Brown. Now the SEC needs to whoop that ass in the bowls. And Go Gators!

Wholesome Goodness said...

SIC, My sense of the BCS was never that they had a new plan for matching up the two best teams, but followed the same old plan, except all conferences were now on board. If you recall, with the old Bowl Alliance(pre-BCS), every major conference had an agreement for the National Championship game except for the Pac-10 & Big 10, who held on to the Rose Bowl. What the BCS did was include all conferences so that #1 vs. #2 would be in one game instead of possibly two, i.e. 1997.

Really, they never improved on deciding who #1 and #2 were, but just used more polls to decide. Anyone who said it was going to be objective was both trying to fool themselves and trying to fool those around them. A playoff won't solve the problem either, because it will still be based on those ranking systems, and someone will be left out eventually, unless you want to do an 119 team tournament.

I think our only chance this year to squeeze in would have been for Florida to trade for the USC cheerleader, so that she would lobby and cheer for Michigan on poll day.

Jerry Palm said...

supposedly the tie breaker is best BCS win (ie highest BCS opponent defeated). Florida would go based on them beating LSU

Jim said...

Thanks for the response, Jerry.

Anonymous said...

Seriously, how could you all NOT mention Katherine Harris being a relative of Ben Hill Griffin?

Go Gators.

Jones said...

Maybe you could check your omniscience at the door for this discussion? You seem so certain that everyone who voted Florida ahead of Michigan ONLY did it because 1) Urban Meyer controls their minds, 2) They hate Michigan with a blind, white-hot hatred, 3) They don't want a rematch.

Um, what if some of them think Florida is the 2nd best team in the nation? Is that so unreasonable? And why would it be categorically wrong to jump Michigan after Florida beat a good Arkansas team? I think everyone is getting a little too carried away with the "we were jobbed" thing to realize that, hey, Florida is a damn good team. A lot of OBJECTIVE fans do think Florida would beat Michigan.

I guess it's just funny to me that everyone here seems to think it is an outright fact that Michigan is the 2nd best team in the nation, when you could make as good a case (or better) for at least one other team, possibly more. Beast in Bama knew they were the two best in mid-October? Jeebus, give me a break.

surrounded in columbus said...

given the margins in the polls, they didn't need to lobby everyone, just enough. and i don't think it was a "real" conspiracy, as much as a very public, media driven campaign. sort of like P&G introducing a new line of dish washing liquid w/ a clever campaign ad.

and here's the really funny part- all the mark mays of the world, trumpeting FLA's qualifications? where do you think they'll be when you spank them by a couple/three TDs in the game? tosu is going to pound FLA and you know it. it won't be close by half time.

then, after it's clear michigan was a better team than FLA, gave tosu a better match (in columbus no less) and would have likely played them close (or at least closer than FLA did) again, do you think we'll read anything about how the bcs & pollsters got it wrong? when the score ends up something like 42-17, do you think lou holtz is going to make the mea culpa "gee, maybe FLA wasn't really the second best team"??

no. they're all going to go on like they got this right.

frankly, maybe i'll wait until after half of america has turned the tv off in the 3rd quarter, and then email may/holtz/meyer/danielson et al, and ask them: "are you really sure that was the game america wanted to see??"

surrounded in columbus said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
surrounded in columbus said...

where have you seen anything written saying anyone (other gator fans) thinks Fla is a better team? vegas puts us a 6 pt favorite against them. we were a 6 pt dog in columbus gainst tosu. we were a projected 5 pt dog this time around. vegas has FLA as 8+ pt dog already.

and it's not about hating michigan or loving urban (where did you read that?). it's about the bcs waking up sunday morning, realizing usc had lost, and thinking "oh shit, if the polls don't change, the big ten will lock up the mnc".

sure. some of the pollsters probably thought FLA looked better. but do you really think that all the coaches and all the harris' polsters who switched their vote, after two weeks of carrying Fla one or two places behind michigan, woke up and suddenly changed their minds? or stupider still, looked at the two teams seriously for the first time?

not a conspiracy theory. just a wide spread reaction to the situation.

i'm not omniscient (though omnipotence would probably be cool)so please post any non FLA websites/news articles, etc., trumpeting that vegas and the rest of the world is wrong, and that FLA is a better team and would beat michigan. i'd love to read them.

Anonymous said...

You should start a caption contest with the Weis/Harris pic. "Is that mustard you are wearing?"

wds4usc said...

Sorry I haven't been here for a bit--some idiot on the lsuoverusc site caused me some problems. Anyway, I just want to support Michigan--you guys backed us in the stupid 2003 "fight" over the split and must return the favor.

It's sad when the system caused the Rose Bowl to be a consolation prize. However, when it comes to class you guys are still the winners. We look forward to a true traditional classic game although we both have to stay out of a stupor after this weekend.

See you in Pasadena!!!

jones said...

Well, fortunately, I wasn't talking about how a bunch of writers have been talking about Florida being better than Michigan, Florida deserving the NC game, etc., because, frankly, who cares? I'm talking about objective fans. In that list I would include myself and any of the 25 or so people I've talked college ball with in the last week. We don't live in Michigan or Ohio; I'm guessing that's where the disconnect is. You have to realize that there's a world outside of the midwest/north, that doesn't immediately assume Michigan to be #2. I'm sure their reasoning varies, but it's naive to assume that, "If you have the gall to put Michigan 3rd, it can only be because they didn't win their conference or because they've already played OSU."

As for the writers who voted Florida #2, well, I'd just as soon not sift through a bunch of poorly-written sports articles to find out why they moved the Gators up. But, again referring to the above point, you're fooling yourself if you think this was only done because of a distaste for a UM/OSU rematch. Maybe, just MAYBE, some of them decided, "You know what? If Florida wasn't a REALLY good team, they would not have beaten #9 LSU, #8 Arkansas, and #13 Tennessee. It's entirely likely, that, based on their impressive wins and their only loss being to another quality team, they may be the #2 team in the country. I'll vote them that way."

Anyway, consider me "the rest of the world", the voice of the common man unfortunate enough to not be a fan of the unequivocally, undoubtedly, inarguably 2nd best team on the face of the earth, Michigan. (Who was voted down to #3 in the polls).

TitleIX said...

as a COMPLETELY random aside---
a shout out to Wolvermarine.
I'm thinking about you!!!

Unky Rob said...

Just looking forward to when OSU beats UF, UM beats USC, Wis beats Ark, and if by some miracle ND beats LSU, the final rankings could look as such.

1. ohio state
2. michigan
3. wisconsin

something to dream about..

jones said...

And another completely random aside (well, kinda). The second-most ridiculous thing to me about the whole process (aside from not having a playoff or at LEAST a +1 game), is the fact that these games will be played over a MONTH after the teams played their last game--in Michigan and Ohio State's case, MUCH more than a month later. So anything can happen; it's like the first game of the season again. One team usually comes out flat, one comes out on fire, and it seems to be completely random. That's why many of the games turn out to be complete crapfests, and, in my opinion, are actually pretty shaky as far as determining who the best team THAT SEASON was. What if OSU comes out flat after a 6-week layoff, and the Gators come out sharp? Florida wins by 17. Are they then definitely the best team? Of course not. It just seems like a poor barometer of quality, to say, "Alright, good season, you're in the game. Now wait a month, gorge yourself over the holidays, and you can play the most important game of your career next year. Good luck!" Stupid.

Anonymous said...

By Florida fan logic, Boise State should be in the championship game, right? They won their conference and have ZERO losses, so don't they deserve to play Ohio State? This garbage about the SEC being the best conference makes me sick. Why does everyone say it's the best conference? Can anyone in that conference succeed on offense without a trick play? Seriously, did everyone watch that Ark/Fla game on Saturday? Also, feel free to have ANY real SEC team play a non-conference game on the road! What a joke. Ohio State will win by at least 21, LSU will lose by 14, Wisconsin will win by 13 and then what will Urban say about his beloved SEC?

surrounded in columbus said...

so you don't have any references about which team is better, other than your own? don't have time to google that one, huh? that's what i thought. you'll excuse me for being underwelmed by your point.

as far as the scope of my world view, i didn't vote M #2 in all the polls on 11/19. or #3 in the coaches on 11/26. the pollsters did. the same polls that voted FLA #4.

and so it just seems narrow minded (or how about "parochial" or "provincial"?) of me to you that i'd get the idea that michigan was a) ranked ahead of FLA, or b) that we were #2? and getting out more would help me how? if i had been in NY or Calif the last month i would have read different AP/USAToday?Harris polls the previous 3 weeks than the ones i read at home?

when FLA beats tosu, you stop back by here and give me the big "i told you so", okay? maybe i'll ask Yost to let me put up a guest post entitled "gee, was i wrong"?

until then, i'll stick by the position that michigan is one of the two best teams in the country, and FLA ain't. and everyone but urban meyer knows it.

jones said...

Well, for one, there are the people that everyone here is bitching about: Gary Danielson, Colin Cowherd, et al. Obvious ones, and admittedly dipshits, but there's 2.

Schlabach agrees. http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/story?columnist=schlabach_mark&id=2684345

Mandel makes it clear that he can't tell which team is better, while saying that the voters probably thought, concerning Michigan being #2, "'You know what? Maybe it's not as sure as I thought.'"

Michael Ventre points out the obvious: it's impossible to say that there IS a #2 team.

And, since you want some fan input other than my own, a FoxSports poll had 51/49 results in favor of Michigan (http://msn.foxsports.com/cfb/story/6232016) which I'm SURE is only because half of those 300K are in Florida, while an ESPN SportsNation poll was in the 54/46 variety (you'll have to excuse my lack of effort since the Poll wasn't available in their archives). I know, I know, the overwhelming show of support for Michigan is deafening, right?

So, there's a couple for starters. Those are only on the major sites. But, I guess if you want more articles posted, you'll come back with another smarmy, shit-eating, sarcastic post requesting them, and I may go to the trouble of spending minutes looking for them. After all, there are only 80 million sports articles written every day; certainly only a few of them will disagree with your well-formed, expert opinion.

As for the polls that voted Michigan #2 (and then #3) in November... um, that was in November, wasn't it? Florida's season wasn't finished--but I guess it's fair to judge them on an incomplete season, since everyone with half a brian already knew that Michigan was the God-ordained #2 team in the nation. AFTER the season was complete, Florida was ranked #2. I know, it's silly that a win over the #8 team would impact people's impressions of Florida, but, what can ya do?

Hopefully you see where all of this is going. Nobody knows. You don't know, I don't know. You think Michigan would beat Florida on a neutral field, I think the opposite. It's all opinion, but since most of the opinions you choose to focus on are from people who are bitching about Michigan getting shafted, you think the whole world agrees with you. Wrong. Understandable, but wrong.

Hope that clears it up. Cheers!

Yost said...

Welcome back, WDS4USC. Should be a good game. Totally agree that the Rose Bowl screwed itself agreeing to this stupid system.

And thought the same thing Unky Rob. Would be very cool.

Jim said...

I'll bite. I think UofF is the second best team in the country based on the incomplete data we (as fans, poll voters, etc.) have to go on. So, don't say "everyone except Urban", ok? You usually have very good, objective posts that I usually get a big kick out of reading, now you're just understandably letting great passion for a very historical and storied program interfere with objecive thought. For the record, based on the same incomplete data we (as fans, poll voters, etc.) have to go on, I also think Michigan also has rightful claim for second. So far, it has not been proven that any team has broken the BCS rules to get ranked where they are. You're mission now is to take Auburn 2004's side and make some noise in the off season about the need for a playoff system. Tommy T and Urban have both bitched all season for such a system and got chastised on here royally for doing so. Don't change sides now.

Anonymous said...

The fact that both arguments are compelling tells me that this system is FATALLY flawed. I'm getting sick of all these debates every two years or so. In a perfect world, Michigan would play Florida for the right to play tOSU in the championship. We could call it the "Ad-lib" Bowl, because such an improvisation is the only logical choice to solve this problem. But, since when has the BCS ever dealt with logic?

statprof said...

care to articulate how Arizona state's SOS is rated #9 by sagarin with THIS ooc schedule then...

N. Arizona, Nevada, Colorado, Hawaii

It's not that mysterious. (1) They played 9 conference games in a BCS conference (and being at the butt-end of the conference, played 7 teams better than them). (2) Their conference brethren, who they played, played mostly BCS and a smattering of decent non-BCS teams -- way way way more quality than the SEC, B10, or B12. (3) Colorado is BCS and Nevada is decent. (They didn't play Hawaii.)

srudoff said...

wow - someone on bucknuts researched this....

Florida has only left the southeastern US/SEC region 8 times in the past 30 years and in those games, the Gators are 0-7-1.

1995 Fiesta Bowl - Loss
1991 Syracuse - Loss
1989 Freedom Bowl - Loss
1987 Aloha Bowl - Loss
1983 USC - Tie
1982 Blue Bonnet Bowl - Loss
1979 Houston - Loss
1976 Sun Bowl - Loss

that's an amazing stat.

Jim said...

Yost, Benny, et. al. - maybe your next live web party should involve one of those vibrating games with players representing UofM and UofF players for the opportunity to play OSU. You guys could call the plays live, as in, "Tebow takes the snap and does his usually left run, no wait, now he's going in circles, now he and his fullback are locked up in a mad circle." You could have Urban on the sidelines represented by the little baby figurine that comes in a King Cake for Mardi Gras. Carr could be represented by a stoic, quiet Rook chess piece. The Henne figure could wear a t-shirt that says, "The Army wants me because they're pretty damn sure I'm the only one that can overthrow the Taliban." Anon could be in the stands with a sign that says, "Go Bucks!" and Weiss could be at the concession stand looking in his secret extra large decoder ring for loose change.

Anonymous said...

srudoff - That is a crazy stat about Florida.

Jim said...

What's Ohio State's record in the State of Florida in the past 6 years?
Oh that's right - 0-2 and both losses to (what was the quote I read on here about the Cocks? oh I know), "shitty South Carolina."

Anonymous said...

Like it or not Michigan had its shot and it lost. That is why you line up and play the game. In addition Michigan did not win the Big 10. The Gators won the SEC and have yet to play OSU. It fits. Besides nothing would be settled in a remach, if Michigan were to win, it would settle nothing and if OSU were to win, it would cast doubt as to who was the real champion.

What I want to know is did Michigan have a choice Rose or Sugar? If so, how come they did not come south to play a worthy opponet? Who wants to play USC or ND? Both schools suck and are over rated. USC lost to two un-ranked teams and how is it that ND is even in the top 25??

srudoff said...

Colorado is BCS but is 2-10
Nevada is mid major
N. Arizona not even
Hawaii is an upcoming bowl game - my mistake but even more funny cause at least they are ranked but don't count in SOS yet.

Plus they finished in the middle of their conference and only played 5 teams better than them and only 3 of those are ranked.

You said OOC was the key to the Pac 10's SOS both from a conf level and an individual level. So playing a mid major, a 2-10 BCS school, and a low major gets you the #8 toughest schedule in the country simply because your intra conference opponents played 14 bcs games?

I don't think anyone could convince me that Arizona played the 8th toughest schedule in the country.

08/31 N Arizona W 35-14
09/09 Nevada W 52-21
09/16 at Colorado W 21-3
09/23 at #21 California L 49-21
09/30 #14 Oregon L 48-13
10/14 at #3 USC L 28-21
10/21 Stanford W 38-3
10/28 at Washington W 26-23
11/04 at Oregon St L 44-10
11/11 Wash St W 47-14
11/18 UCLA L 24-12
11/25 at Arizona W 28-14
12/24 vs Hawaii 8:00 PM

srudoff said...

that's great jim

will the NCG be played IN florida?

thanks for playing along though

Jim said...

People throw out bs arguments cut and fitting like a rental tux for a cheap wedding. Anyone can play that game.
Good post on AZ though.

Jim said...

cut & fitted I mean

srudoff said...

the only reason I put that stat out there about Florida was because 1. it amazed me that they don't travel outside of their region and 2. it's relevant only because this game will be out of their region. i would have posted it even it if said they were 7-0-1 because i can't believe a major school can travel out of their region just 8 times in over 30 years.

i don't think that stat says anything though about who's going to win in Glendale - i really don't think it's going to be close as you would have guessed.

thanks for the props on my AZ state post btw (i said Arizona but it was AZ state)

Anonymous said...

Let’s face it, Michigan got screwed. Is it the rest of the world’s fault? No, Michigan had an opportunity to beat Ohio State and failed to capitalize. However, Florida also lost during the season and had several close calls to inferior teams. Both teams are flawed in that aspect.

We have heard all the excuses so far. Michigan is out because it already lost to Ohio State. Florida deserves a shot because it won its conference. Michigan didn’t win its conference. Michigan barely lost to the #1 team in the country. Florida had the toughest schedule. Michigan blasted almost all the teams it played during the season. The Big Ten is weak. Ohio State should not have to beat Michigan again. Need I say more?

The BCS is completely unfair. No matter how much tweaking is performed on the system, it always seems to fail. Every year someone gets screwed over for some reason or another. This year it was Michigan’s turn. Next year it will probably be a team from the Big 12.

The truth of the matter is that college football needs a playoff of some sort to settle issues like this. We could have a 4 or 8 team playoff and let the players determine the outcome. We could also continue with the bowl games for the other 56 or 60 teams. There is no reason why both systems could not exist at the same time. Unfortunately, it will never happen because of three simple reasons:

1.The bowl games are too profitable for the universities, conferences, coaches, and corporate sponsors.

2.Television ratings thrive on controversy.

3.Fans will travel to see their team no matter what.

As much as it sucks, it looks like we will be stuck with this system for a long time. Hopefully next time, Michigan will be on the inside looking out.

Anonymous said...

Michigan isn't even the best team in their conference. How in the hell did they expect to play in the national title game? The BCS got it right.

Florida will beat OSU by 7. USC will beat Michigan by 3 and LSU will crush ND.

surrounded in columbus said...

thanks for nudge. maybe i'm off a bit today. but i don't think it's been by that much.

i thought i had been clear that i had no beef w/ FLA fans or Meyers for thinking they're #2, wanting to play tosu, and feeling deserving of the bid. i also thought i had been clear that i didn't fault them for campaigning for the spot.

i have never suggested FLA did anything "wrong".

that said, my bitch has consistently been that "the bcs" didn't follow its own mandate and instead made this year's selection a "beauty contest" (& the Auburn folks are right- they got f'd worse, but that doesn't make this less wrong, just less egregious).

there are countless news articles, talking heads, even those who agree w/ FLA getting the game, who have made the same point: in the final decision, the selection was not made on the basis of which team was 2nd best- it was made on a host of other considerations. considerations the bcs may never have gotten past (as wholesome goodness pointed out) but was supposed to address.

maybe i am just wrong here. maybe the pollsters, dozens and dozens of them all in one night, looked over the two teams and all came to the same, startling, and reverse decision- FLA was just a better team. i don't think that's what happened, but it could have.

maybe they watched FLA play SC, W. Carolina, and then Ark and all suddenly saw the light. i don't buy it, but maybe.

as for "who's #2?", you're entitled to your opinion. i guess that makes two now, You & Urban ;).

my beef is not that the polls flipped, but why & how. if you saw Herbstriet over the weekend, he was pretty much saying the same thing. i don't think i'm too far out on a limb w/ this.

in about 6 weeks, we'll have a much better idea.

vulpesto said...

Thank you for pointing that out. I didn't realize that the Pac 10 teams all played 9 conference games instead of 8.

If we don't get a playoff after the current BCS contract expires, I think the Big Ten and Pac 10 (and the Rose Bowl) should just pull out of this whole mess. The BCS already killed tradition more than a playoff ever would. Let's bring some back.

The talking heads on the TV keep saying that a "plus one" format is the next logical step towards a true playoff. If they give us that, then we can go back to the old bowl tie ins and have the top two teams after the bowl games are played play each other for the crown.

Who cares if they don't give us the "plus one" format. We should still pull out of the BCS. We'll have a split national championship every single year until they give us the playoff that we want.

Anonymous said...

LSU will loose to ND. They will come out flat. Who can get up to play ND?? Michigan will loose to USC for the same reason. USC just proved that they are over rated.

The BCS got it right the two best teams in the country are playing. Michigan had its shot on the field and lost. It did not win the Big 10, nor would it settle the issue if they beat OSU in a rematch. And if OSU were to defeat Michigan twice, what would that prove for OSU?

I think LSU would beat UF if they lined up and played again but the tigers had their chance, just like Michigan.

I would much perfered to see Michigan and LSU play and then let the Big 10 and SEC go head to head

bigndfan175 said...

Yost et al... I've actually come to tangentially like Michigan through this site and I simply wanted to relay my condolences for the corn holing you took from the voters. The only solace I take in this injustice is that the Maize and Blue will kick USC's ass in the Rose Bowl.

Question - will you actually cheer for tOSU over FL ?

Jim said...

SIC- classy post and all of your points are points well taken.

Let's hope the OSU-FL game is a good matchup and not one-sided like lots of folks think.

What do you think is the biggest reason folks want to see Florida get demolished?
1. Because they were picked over UofM?
2. Because of Urban's attitude about it all?
3. Because OSU is a Big Ten team.
4. So the SEC will shut up about how good its top teams are?

It does get interesting this time of year.

Anonymous said...

face it folks.... nobody want to see you and usc in the nc game!

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

From a die-hard Michigan fan...

surrounded in columbus said...

can i answer "5 all of the above"?

to a man, almost all of the FLA grads i know are "good" guys that i like. i went to the outback w/against them in '03 and it was a hoot. most of the FLA angst is really towards the system, accented by Urban's approach to this. that's why i've tried to not knock them hard- it's not their fault they have one loss and want to play for the mnc.

in all honsety, by the time the game comes around i'll probably be bleeding orange & blue from all the nonsense by tosu fans here in columbus.

crock said...

to: Anonymous said...

December 04, 2006 2:31 PM

really, after so much controversy and craziness in the past 48 hours - that's all you can come up with? - I'm a chick weighing in at a buck-ten and can come up with something better than that.
have fun watching the gators lose on Jan. 8

Yost said...

Your little cartoon calls Lloyd a whiner? Ha. HA! HAHAHAHAHA!

Good one. No really. Urban took the high road here. Yeah, Gator fans shouldn't be ashamed.

Anonymous said...

crock - you're on the clock - 48 hours to put your money where your mouth is

yost - this came from the University of Florida Student newspaper

Anonymous said...

Real classy post there. Wow, talk about losing any credibility you may have had. Use some class and lose the profanity.

Moving on:

Personally I was almost at the point of hoping we would face UM again. 'They asked for it. Let's give it to em' I think it would be absolutely fascinating watching the OHIO STATE printer machines working overtime churning out Mike Hart's postgame quotes. Dude's 0-3 against us and he still says they have a better team.

BUT> I do say M*ch*g*n is the second best team in the country. I will not argue against that fact. However, if you are complaining about the way the BCS is run, I'll concede that ground to you and we'll imagine it would be run like the NBA or the NFL. Has anyone seen the Lakers and the Spurs in the championship game lately? Five years ago they were clearly the two best teams. Oh wait, they're both in the same conference so when the Lakers won the Conference Championship the Spurs went home to watch a far inferior New Jersey Nets team play and lose to the Lakers. Life sucks. Get over it! I don't like the BCS either but thats why we dont wanna leave it up to the human element. Win all your games and you wouldnt be in this position right now. Personally if we'd be playing Michigan I'd be more excited than I am now, but it didn't happen.

(Not to mention the fact that before THE GAME both Tressel AND LLLLLoyd Carr said the loser should not be permitted to play in the National Championship.) Sorry, should we not take you at your word LLLLLoyd?

statprof said...

Oh, I thought you were asking about the statistics behind the computers ranking the Pac10 school's SOS so high. I didn't realize we were just supposed to say it's stupid because you don't understand it. Check. I think that's all the help I can provide.

Anonymous said...

LSU, and Florida are going to win. USC rolls over Big Blew.

Anonymous said...

All this bickering is pointless. Who cares who the #2 team is? OSU has already knocked off two #2 teams and they are going to make it a third on Jan 8th. Both UF and UM are going to have nothing left to say after that.

That's it. End of controversy.

Anonymous said...

Well, I feel for you guys. I really think Michigan is a better team than Florida but I think a lot of people just didn't want a rematch. But at least Michigan didn't go undefeated, also win a conference championship game, and still get fucked out of it like Auburn a couple of years ago. And I have to agree with your coach, this politicking on TV shit just makes me sick.

wds4usc said...

By the way, not to talk about the "good old days" but if we went back to pre-BCS we would have USC-Ohio State in the Rose, Florida and either Michigan or Louisville in the Sugar and Oklahoma and Louisville or Michigan in the Orange (with BYU in the Holiday vs. Wisconsin and the Fiesta scrambling for the best match-up, probably Boise and Arkansas or Wisconsin). Think about it: No one vs. two but four or five teams STILL alive. Even Wisconsin! I know voters can be pretty awful as has been shown this year but you would at least get two polls and a fighting chance. Lots of schools alive and lots of interest. This year--yawn. And I know how proponents of the BCS say to fight it out on the field--but are you really doing so with such a flawed system? How about one computer-based poll and one human only? So what if there's a split?

Anonymous said...

In my opinion, this whole controversy exemplifies both why we should and should not include humans in the polls; yes, I'm saying that the good and bad reason for having human element in deciding the rankings is the same reason. As many others have said, many human voters in the polls not only screwed over UM, but other teams as well. At the same time, us Wolverines would be grateful to the human element had they been rightfully deemed #2. This is to say, the human element of the polls both make and break the "true" rankings. It scares me to death that some looney can be part of the deciding factor in who gets what ranking (with the exception of some of the coaches who actually watch film of the top 25 teams). I'd rather there be only computer rankings. Shit, a playoff is the easiest solution but we have this same fucking conversation every year and we never get a new system. I don't mean to be a pessimist but, I don't ever see us having a playoff.

matthew said...

As a fan without any allegiance to Michigan, Florida or Ohio State, I personally simply did not want to see a rematch.

Forget how a game is a national championship game for a moment. The purpose of bowls is for teams from different conferences to meet at a neutral site. Arkansas will play Wisconsin, who doesn't seem to have a single great win. USC will play Michigan, who both count a beating of ND as their best win.

Bowls with the right matchups let the better conferences come out of the woodwork. I still remember Cal going through the same exact motions as this site in 2004 over Texas going to number 4. Well, Texas beat Michigan in the rose bowl, while Cal lost to Texas Tech, a team that Texas beat earlier in the year.

So, I'd hate to see a bowl ever pit two teams from the same conference. Just think, if Florida beat ND easily and the rest of the SEC did well in their bowl games including a big Arkansas victory over Wisconsin, we would be scratching our heads about whether the SEC champion just might have been better than the Michigan/OSU victor.

On the other hand, with OSU playing Florida, we still know that OSU is the better team than UM, considering that the two teams played on a 100 yard field for 60 minutes and OSU scored more points.

BTW, I'm a Georgia Tech fan, but I was actually raised a huge FSU fan. If anything, I would be biased against Florida and the SEC, being ACC throughout. But I will never support a game after Christmas between two teams from the same conference. We play the regular season to already determine who in conference is better; we don't need bowl games to tell us.

Anonymous said...

why can't the folks in michigan get someone to help you beat osu?

Anonymous said...

Ray Melick
Tim Neverett
Gene Ponti
Jim Walden
Bobby Aillet
Denny Aldridge
Dick Bestwick
Joe Biddle
Blaine Bishop
Wilt Browning
Earle Bruce
Brentson Buckner
Bob Casciola
Reggie Collier
Gene Corrigan
Eddie Crowder
Pete Dawkins
Doug Dickey
Brian Dohn
Boots Donnelly
Bill Dooley
John Dorsey
Kevin Duhé
Bob Dunlevy
Bert Emanuel
Boomer Esiason
Rondo Fehlberg
Bob Frederick
Mike Grace
Geoff Grammer
Bob Grim
Lee Grosscup
Tom Hammond
Dick Harmon
Ken Hatfield
Tommy Hicks
David Housel
Fred Jacoby
Joe Jacoby
Scott Johnson
Mike Kolen
Roy Kramer
George Lapides
Bobby Leach
Ted Lewis
Iliana Limon
Mike Lucas
Mike Lude
Tom Luicci
Cindy Luis
John Mackovic
Loren Matthews
Lance McIlhenny
Bill McLellan
Ted Miller
Jim Morse
Brad Muster
Denny O'Brien
David Paschall
John Pont
Steve Preece
Paul Roach
Kenny Roda
Irwin Smallwood
Ron Stephenson
Rick Taylor
Max Urick
Roger Valdiserri
Tommy Vardell
Frank Weedon
Jack White
Frank Windegger
Sammy Winder
Hugh Yoshida

There is a list of all the voters from the Harris Poll who put Florida in #2. I encourage you all the email them and ask them what their reasoning was.

Burke said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
JFoosh said...

FLA 41 OSU 14. All you whiners about the Harris Poll care to retract what you posted? Probably not, you just hope no one goes back to see how wrong you were.

collegefootballisnumberone said...

My favorite quote from someone that knows football to those homers that only have a rooting interest in the sport (even the obnoxious OSU fans still eating humble pie)..."You think you know, but you don't know. And you never will."

Folks, Jim Walden has forgotten more about football than you blogging complainers will ever know. Hypocrisy is part of the charm of college football. Just stick to cheering for your team.

Is that spring practice I see peeking around the corner?


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Wednesday, July 18, 2007

SI Screws the Pooch

Blogger extrodinaire, Brian Cook of MGoBlog and AOL Fanhouse (show off) makes it clear to see (via The Realists) why it's just so darn hard to trust the Deathstar that is the MSM. Check out this picture of, as Brian says, SI celebrating "Michigan Legend" Tim Brown...

To quote Brent Musberger here, "Whoooooa, Nellie!"

P.S. If you didn't immediately know that was U-M's Desmond Howard, maybe this isn't the blog for you.

(HT: SH)

John said...

If you didn't realize that "Whooooaaaa Nellie" is actually a Keith Jackson quote, you probably should not be writing a Michigan football blog, seeing that he is the one who originally named Michigan Stadium the Big House.

Yost said...

John. John, John, John. Please tell me you were kidding and you knew that I knew. Please.

Skurny said...

Keith Jackson? The former Eagle/Dolphin/Packer tight end named Michigan Stadium the "Big House"?!?! Maybe I have no business posting on football blog!

Sports on a Schtick said...

Lee Corso thinks that's awesome baby!

The Gardiner Bison said...

Brad Nessler says that is awesome with a Capital A!

Killing My Liver said...

Bob Davies wears a merkin.

god of the whoppers said...

Brent Musberger can burn in hell. that osu/team penske cocksucker is a bitch. he created the bandwagon. it makes me puke.

< /life >

Out of Conference said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Out of Conference said...

Urban Meyer says, "Damn, we need to make some adjustments in the second half."

beast in 'bama said...

So the one on the far left is Desmond Howard then, right?

j said...

You idiots. That's a picture of the Rhondells before their NY concert. Oh wait a minute, I'm sorry, it's the Kinks. Lee Corso is the one on the far right. He was the kinkiest. Now, what's all this about posting if you don't know what's going on?

rweiner18 said...

Cmon, guys. This is stretching it. Please tell me you know that the name is referring to the picture above it, which is clearly someone in gold pants. If that doesn't tip you off, I doubt that Ty Detmer (to the right of Desmond) graudated from A & M in '57.

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Wednesday, April 02, 2008

Burger Joint Bruhaha

Have another "hot button" issue today. Well, okay, "hot button" in A2, that is.

Below is a picture of a new restaurant that opened last month on State Street called Quickie Burger and Dogs:

Just a burger joint and a sign? Well, not to some.

According to the Michigan Daily, "the Stonewall Democrats, a lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender caucus of the University's College Democrats chapter, has taken offense with the restaurant's logo and recently began circulating a petition to sway the owners to change the logo."

They claim the picture of the woman riding the hamburger next to the word "Quickie" contributes to the "objectification of women."

Oooo...kay. And what do the owners say?

"We were thinking beef, rodeo, so instead of putting a cowboy, we just picked a cowgirl. It's a rodeo-style cowgirl riding a bull, but instead, it's a burger. It was put together to be funny and different. No offense was meant to anyone."

And no offense would be taken in 99.9 percent of the country. But you're in A2. Where I think some folks actually look for stuff to be offended by, whether warranted or not. And the sign above definitely falls in the "not" category.

What say you?

Is the Quickie Burger sign offensive?
Yes, it's demeaning
No, it's just a burger sign
pollcode.com free polls

whetstonebuck said...

"the Stonewall Democrats, a lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender caucus of the University's College Democrats chapter, has taken offense with the restaurant's logo and recently began circulating a petition to sway the owners to change the logo."

Screw 'em.

Reed said...

That's nothing, look at what the guy with the hot dog stand outside Harvard Stadium has (you have to page down just a bit).

There's absolutely nothing offensive about the Quickie Burger sign. Though it does look like the cowgirl in question is in the middle of having an accident. But with that look on her face, I'm guessing that she's feeling more relief than shame...

Adam said...

Wow. I'm a Democrat and these Democrats are embarrassing the rest of us.

Not only is the sign not offensive, it's JUST A SIGN. I mean, look at Cluck-U Chicken (it's all over my home state of New Jersey as well as Maryland, where it originated, and there's even one in *gasp* Columbus). Their adds say "luscious legs, big breasts, and terrific thighs" and show women. And girls still eat there.

It's a fucking sign. Get over it. There are lots of other places you can go.

Dezzi said...

I like my women like I like my meat... a little pink in the middle....

Ninja Football said...

I voted yes, (just to be the only vote) and then it turns out I'm number 3. Can I have my vote back?

A stone wall said...

I'm so embarrassed.

Joshua said...

Ok, guess what comes up when you do a Google image search for "embarrassed". A shot of an LSU Tiger strolling into the endzone with a bunch of Buckeyes in the background. Right on the front page. That made my morning.

WV: ynomhe

You down with OPP? Yeah U know me.

(Good luck getting that out of your head.)

phil said...

Before I vote, can I ask what type of patio furniture this restaurant has?

Bigasshammm said...

"the Stonewall Democrats, a lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender caucus of the University's College Democrats chapter,"

To appease these people they should just paint a "Buckstache" on said cowgirl and therefore it will represent all that they love. Gays, Lesbians, Bisexuals, Transexuals, and Republicans.

Have I gone too far?

PS:: Once again I am looking for info on the Spring Game. If anyone has any shoot me an email or maybe Yost can make a thread about it since it actually involves football. :)

TitleIX said...

Kinda funny that you all would be discussing whether or not something objectifies women, since, uh aside from football talk, that's all you guys do. Not a very neutral crowd around here...
I'm just sayin!

Let's see---
said 'cowgirl' is sans cowboy hat and has flowing blonde hair, and she's using a beer mug to balance herself. yep, that's what professional women rodeo riders look like.....
Just like Hooters is an homage to owls.
(cue Andy: mmmmmm owls, love ya bub)

Quickie Burgers absolutely meant to suggest/depict/imply a 'quickie' with the blondie on the beef.
Personally, I've been driving by the sign for weeks and have found it sophmoric, stupid, and slightly offensive.
Worthy of a petition?
But I'm I glad that it once again raises the depiction of women in public places as there is a continuum of acceptable images and an amazing inconsistency and double standard. That hierarchical chaos is also contextual--meaning that the SI swimsuit issue is fine for all to see yet Hustler needs to be covered and kept behind the counter.
Vegas showgirls dress a certain way yet there are no tank tops allowed in a 'normal' work environment.

Look---let's not get all righteously indignant about democrats and other marginalized groups for expressing their upset with the sign and deny the truth re: the intent of the sign.

I chose to frequent this site because that kind of sophmoric silliness doesn't scare me (and sometimes it's funny) but it sure as heck doesn't need to be up on the corner of State and Hill for all to be confronted with. It's stoopid and offensive to me in that context. Maybe I'm just bitter as a non-blonde? ha!

Party-pooping over
Go back to your regularly scheduled 'it's just a sign dude, don't be so GAY, sheez' discussions.

TitleIX said...

spring game at Saline High School, not open to the public

Dezzi said...

If they want... I can put my wang in a hot dog bun and they can post that on the other side so it's fair?

(Was going to insert a comment about needing a footlong bun... but that would be too small for me...)

Temp430 said...

The owners should change the sign by giving the cowgirl more cleavage and re-work the hat to look more like a condom.

Lexus said...

What does Art Price, Jr. think? That's what I want to know!

Crabapple Buck said...

BTW - The owl tastes like chicken.

Hemlock Philosopher said...

T-IX, The use of "sophomoric" should be limited to once per post. CB - owl tastes like chicken because when they were programming the Matrix, and trying to produce a believable similation of what life should be like, there were some pieces of information that they were missing. One of these was what chicken was supposed to taste like. None of the programmers had a clue what chicken should taste like, so they just made it taste like everything.

Chris in NC said...

Wow. I find myself in rare sort of agreement with titleix on a social/political issue. Jot this one down for the history books. Anyone who doesn't think that the implication is a quickie with the blonde on the burger is fooling themselves. They knew it when it was first put up and they know it now. Let's see if they bend over and drop trow for the whiners.

This is just advertising 101. The fact is if most women got hot and bothered at the mere sight of a good looking man, you can bet there would be a whole lot of shirtless man signs up too. Unfortunately, ladies, a sign can't rub your back yet. Men don't need that to get their attention. A woman, any woman, will do. Hey, don't blame us, we were made that way. We didn't choose to be like that!

Now, is it really offensive? Please! It's just a sign dude, don't be so gay, sheez! :)

Of course, the "Stonewall Democrats" are using basic advertising 102. When you are a whiney special interest group that no one knows about or cares about, find something to be offended by and make a stink. It's good for the money coffers.

Jeremy said...

Why is nobody concerned about what happened to Tubby's?

You can eat when you find the DuFranes.

beast in 'bama said...

Anyone see a parallel with the new Subway ad campaign, $5 Footlong? Have you seen it? There's Godzilla storming through a city skyline, juxtaposed with a woman holding up her hands in a "foot long" gesture, all the while shaking her head "NO!"

This kind of imagery is everywhere.

matthew said...

People really need to get off this "it offends me, so it shouldn't exist" bullshit.

You're offended? So what? Go ahead and be offended. Who gives a rat's ass?

Last time I checked, you have every right to be offended for whatever lame reason. You also have the right to not care. But let me make the following statement very clear: The law of the land does not, and should not, protect you from being offended.

In addition: it gets my goat that the same group of people who reject moral legislation by the conservative movement are willing to protest practices that they find "offensive"... hello PETA?

Feelin' Blue said...

Maybe they should put her in reverse cowgirl instead.

I am embarrassed as a Michigan alum, but hey, it's expected. I can't believe these prudes though. They are seriously circulating a petition to change a sign that is mildly suggestive? What a joke. Pick your battles.

whetstonebuck said...

"Look---let's not get all righteously indignant about democrats and other marginalized groups for expressing their upset with the sign and deny the truth re: the intent of the sign."

Keep marginalized groups in the margins!

Feelin' Blue said...

This reminds me of the No Thai! mini-fiasco from a few months ago.

Some students offended by No Thai!

Jeremy said...

Nobody is saying that they shouldn't be *able* to use that imagery. They're organizing people who also find it offensive and petitioning the owners to change it. One of the most important ingredients in free speech is opposing speech which you find to be false or offensive, not by banning it, but by refuting it.

Killing My Liver said...

BY all means, be offended. If you are offended by the sign, don't eat there, petition, etc.
And, if that offends you, don't look at any magazine(including womens mags), watch TV or even listen to the radio. The overtone in this sign is slight.
It's your right to express your opinion, feel free to do so as you move into the wilderness as to not be offended by signs.

BARman said...

Matthew--right on. It's all becoming so much crap. Mountains out of molehills; hypocrisy of the whiners; power via victimhood...yadayada, on and on, forever and ever, ad nauseum...

zen wizard said...

I would have rather seen her riding a huge hot dog.

But other than that...

surrounded in columbus said...

Okay- not to quibble on semantics, but isn’t ALL commercial art some level of “objectification”? commercials/ads convey a message (BUY THIS NOW! Or something similar) and the art is supposed to convey that same message. if it didn't objectify the images, it wouldn't be effective.

The Marlborough Man out on I-94 objectifies men: “Be a real man. Be a cowboy. Ride a horse, be strong and tall in the saddle. Smoke ciggies like your father did. Only pansies worry about lung cancer.”??? Right?

When do you see men portrayed as weak? Hair loss and “male enhancement” commercials. men as dull and dimwitted? in car GPS commercials (an no, i never stop for directions either).

Cute babies are on diaper commercials showing children as cuddly, adoring objects. I suppose cute babies’ diapers are less smelly than an ugly babies’?

Ugly kids are used for selling cleaning products (apparently ugly kids make bigger messes than the cute ones).

the ad featuring the “desperate housewives” soccer mom driving a particular mini van or mopping the floor w/ the new swiffer sends a message to mini van driving/floor swiffering women (and men) everywhere.

and how about the newer, subtler messages that show the attractive 40 something being "admired" by her teenage son's friends for serving the right chicken nuggets as a snack??? holy "Stacy's Mom..."! not only does that objectify women, but it does so (assumedly) to sell to the woman- "yeah, young guys will still dig you, even at 42, if you feed them"?

This sign is no different. It says: “red meat eating, over sexed and in a hurry men- come have a burger here and hot blondes will love having a quickie w/ you, no matter how fat & bald you are.”

Honestly- how different is that from any beer commercial???? we all know the kind of woman that finds you attractive in a bar depends on what you order. Heineken? brunette in the DKNY suit. Miller Lite? Blonde in the Daisy Dukes. right?

or have i been watching too much tv?

Geoff said...

And here I thought we only had to deal with this kind of nonsense out in Washington.

Political correctness run rampant......

phil said...

SIC - good points about advertising and its allure. For example, I was in Home Depot yesterday and they had this patio table and umbrella that was positioned.....well, it was just soooo hot. I do admit to flirting with it, but I resisted the temptation to buy it, but man, that garden manager knew just how to manipulate a guy.

Jim said...

You know what's funny? Their explanation of the origin of the sign could be completely true.

I was doing a lecture to a group of teachers on shark reproduction once. I was searching around for a good image to use on the title slide and couldn't find anything I liked so I decided to grab a completely random animal image--just to be weird/random/funny. It'd been a long week of workshops and that's my sense of humor. It could have been any animal--armadillo, springer spaniel, giraffe--anything...but it wasn't. It was a beaver. It was late and I was tired and I didn't really think about it at all. I even labeled it with an arrow that said "This is a beaver."

Thankfully we discovered my little faux pas while reviewing the slides with a female co-worker (who knew my sense of humor, and that no offense was intended). The look on her face, though, was priceless. Man, I took crap for that for years.

whetstonebuck said...

SiC...making sense...Holy Cow!

Must be that Columbus atmosphere.

jcloverboi said...

not really sure what all the hubbub is about. Yeah, the sign probably isn't in great taste, but I'm sure there are many far more egregious examples of objectification on tv, radio, and in print. perhaps it's because the sign is on/near campus--people tend to care more about issues that are close to home. not eating there would make a much larger impact than raising a stink about the sign. if anything, the flap over the sign is giving the restaurant some free publicity.

beast in 'bama said...

Phil: While I'm a firm believer in free speech, I'm afraid you're going to have to stop. LOL (both comments)!

Jim: In another life (20 years ago) I was covering a rural county commission meeting as a young reporter at the local paper. I showed up early and was talking with several of the commissioners as we waited for the meeting to begin.

As these were all rural, Alabama men - and it was not football season - the conversation turned to growing up in the country, specifically to some of the odd things they had eaten as children (possums, dandelions, poke salad, neutrea, etc.)

Finally one of the commissioners, a cotton farmer from my own district, spoke up in his low, painfully stereotypic Alabama drawl: "Any a' ya'll evah eaten anah beevuh?"

The lone woman in the room at the time turned as red as I did - she out of embarrassment, me from trying to control hysterical laughter. The others? No, none of the rest of them had ever eaten any beaver.

Word verification? bvvehf
Coincidence? I think not.

Out of Conference said...

Well the motto on the back of the menu probably says, "Nothing's better than meeting your girl in a park, except parking your meat in a girl!"

Red said...

The owners should just put up a picture of a guy wearing a cowboy hat, vest and chaps with him swallowing a big ol hot dog to appease those angry queers in A2.

MGoBlue93 said...

No Thai! has gone through the same thing. And I recall there was a falafel stand which was the frequent target of protests during my daze in A2. The moral of this story is, is there a restaurant in A2 which someone cannot be offended by? Seriously.

whetstonebuck said...

"said 'cowgirl' is sans cowboy hat and has flowing blonde hair, and she's using a beer mug to balance herself. yep, that's what professional women rodeo riders look like....."

Hate to burst your bubble, but that is what some of them look like around here. By some, I mean enough of them to warrant the picture as normal.

If you want to protest the picture protest on behalf of giant sentient hamburgers being tortured by women.

Sarah Bellum said...

This is an issue, seriously? I just want a tee-shirt bearing this image!

TitleIX said...

hemlock--touche re: my spelling. glad that an opportunity to call me out brought you out from the lurkers. :-) welcome back.

guess that I'm going to have give back my Red Hot Lovers T-shirt.

Catie said...

I am a democrat (practically a bleeding heart much to the dismay of my highly republican family) And, Although T9 makes a beautiful point, I am personally not offended.

Now if she was riding a hot dog, that might be more blatant. But seriously sex sells folks and that is what this is, marketing in a college town.

Mikoyan said...

Where is PETA in all this? AFter all, this place sells meat....

dtw2phx said...

Offended?? HA! I wanna see how the menu items are listed. Extras such as slit pickles, special sauces, and sausage-wallet-Saturdays!

CaliGirl said...

My best friend's brother owns this place...he sent my boyfriend and me a t-shirt...I wear it proudly to support him...so I guess no offense taken here...

Mikoyan said...

But the important question...

How's the food? Heck, if I'm gonna go to that part of Ann Arbor, I might as well go about 3 or 4 blocks west and go to Blimpy Burger. Is it comparable to Blimpy Burger?

lieutenant winslow said...

the lack of one or more conspicuously placed hotdog leads me to believe that the stonewalls have a lot to learn about objectifying women


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Monday, May 12, 2008

Mike Barwis's Cats

And you thought Michigan's new strength and conditioning coach was only tough on the players?

Hell, even his pets can't escape this workout-crazed madman as the secretly obtained clip below illustrates.

(HT: T9)

Catie said...

The one cat was smarter than the other, figuring out that he could get further by jumping on the thing at the top.

I do have to say (sorry, but) I think it was mean to turn the speed up, I felt bad for the kitties, they were trying so hard and making it go faster was just mean. Otherwise, cute video.....although a video of Barwis running would have been far more entertaining! YUM!

TitleIX said...

catie, friend, you are too sensitive.
the cats LOVE it.
and, you know, if they can't take it....they can always leave

Catie said...

Yeah, yeah, I tend to be on the compassionate side, nothing to be sorry for, it comes in handy in my line of work! You make a good point though, they could leave (and they did, lol)

whetstonebuck said...

Their little kitty souls need consumin'.

surrounded in columbus said...

ah, wets, now we know what the sweater vest is knitted from, ala Cruela De Tressel...

Feelin' Blue said...

Since this video was made, one of the cats actually ended up transferring to a new home further south, citing a decline in pack values.

Mikoyan said...

Hmmm, looks like the Ohio State entry for alternative energy generation.

"We didn't get enough power from 1 cat....Maybe if we use 2..."

Bigasshammm said...

Catie said...
The one cat was smarter than the other, figuring out that he could get further by jumping on the thing at the top.

Not so. I believe the first cat was the smartest since he would stand at the back and just use his front feet to run on the treadmill. All the while thinking to himself "Look at that dumbass trying to keep up with this thing and almost falling on his face repeatedly. Glad I brought my easy button."

Another way you could look at this video is from the UM S&C program then and now. Then - kitty jumps on treadmill realizes the work is hard so falls off back and only gives half effort. Now - other kitty jumps on treadmill and works his paws off to keep up with the thing as it goes faster. When he falls off he gets right back on and keeps trying.

Uplifting UM reference of the day. You're welcome!

Bigasshammm said...

I do like in the video the point at which they are speeding it up and the second cat just looks at the camera and gives a total "WTF!?" face.

OSURulz said...

This seems like the only appropriate time fot that Nittany Lion growl to be piped in.

Justin said...

Any truth to the rumor that those cats names are Boren and Mallet? Did you see how easily they gave up? Seems like they also have another thing in common with their human namesakes.....


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Wednesday, January 05, 2011

Coaching Conclave Continues in Ann Arbor

(from MZone wire reports) Ann Arbor, MI - Michigan fans remained gathered outside Schembechler Hall on Wednesday still waiting for a sign that athletic director Dave Brandon had made a decision regarding the Wolverine head coaching situation.

But the black smoke pouring out of the smoke stack atop Schembechler Hall indicated that Brandon's coaching conclave was continuing.  Wednesday marks the 40th day of Brandon's so-called "evaluation" of current coach Rich Rodriguez making it the longest known job review in recorded history.

According to tradition, black smoke above Schembechler Hall indicates a coaching decision has not yet been made; white smoke indicates Rich Rodriguez has been fired; and maize and blue smoke along with streamers and lollipops shooting out of the piping would indicate that Jim Harbaugh is the new Michigan coach.

UPDATE: The smoke is now white as Rich Rod has maybe kinda in due time after another 40 day evaluation if Dave Brandon's Magic 8-Ball says so finally been fired.

Meanwhile, after every news outlet in Detroit erroneously announced that he had been fired on Tuesday, Rich Rodriguez celebrated at least one more day on the job by showing off the errant Free Press headline announcing his axing.

(HT to Mikoyan for the idea and RR 'Shop, HT to DC for the smoke pic. Thanks!)

phil said...

Yost, Andy, T9 - you guys are asking for trouble:

Dave Brandon: Rich, what is the worst football blog on this campus?
RR: Well that would be hard to say, sir. They're each outstanding in their own way.
Dave : Cut the horseshit, coach. I've got their tweets right here. Who photoshopped black smoke coming out of Schembechler Hall? Who keeps putting up Jim Harbaugh pictures? Every Halloween, they laugh at your defensive scheme. Every spring, they ridicule your recruiting record. And now, the final straw is the 3 year long “Evaluation” satire.
RR: You're talking about MZone, sir.
DB: Of course I'm talking about MZone, you TWERP!

wingedhelmet said...

Great Work! Thanks for the effort to provide some humor and distraction from the train wreck that is the Michigan football coach-evaluation-hire-search.

I am reminded how much I missed this site during the hiatus.

I have been "all in" for Michigan for more than 50 years, of course I lost my Michigan Fan/Supporter status 3 seasons ago when I failed to support the hiring of Rich Rod.

I know a little bit about hiring and firing executives and I will give DB the benefit of the doubt that there must exist a set of factors that are not obvious. I will allow that these circumstances are the cause of the sacrifice the last month of the program, the public embarassment of Rich Rod (not that I think a little karma is necessarily a bad thing)and making ND look like the model of Coach hiring efficiency.

I am choosing to believe that either DB;
1. Had an agreement with JH and JH changed his mind
2. Has hired a new HC and is talking RR into staying as OC
3. Has hired a sweater vest wearing coach of another B10 school and had to wait for their bowl to be over

or there is some *unlikely* reason.

Or maybe there is a curse upon the winningest college football program.

Dennis said...

There is something rather Biblical about the 40 day evaluation process. As a Buckeye, I really am starting to feel bad for you guys. Part of that, I imagine, is done in hope that the football gods will not visit this upon our house when Tressel leaves.

The last few years of Michigan and Notre Dame has been like the Cripple Fight between Timmy and Jimmy on South Park. But it has taken some of the fun out of beating you guys at the end of the season. I think your wins in the Cooper years were more satisfying for you than ours have been especially over the last few years. I'm in that subset of OSU fans that wants you guys to win every game until ours. I'd like to see 2006 every year. Except for the epic BCS meltdown part.

surrounded in columbus said...

Well, I for one can't wait for the white smoke to signal the hiring of Brady Hoke. Once THAT happens, we can all rest easy. Talk about your "home run" hires, huh?

Just look in the mirror & repeat it to yourself outloud- "Brady Hoke, coaching genius". Eventually, you'll fall in love with the sound of it.

I know that's what I'm doing (along with still slinging hurricanes after having emptied the bar in the box suite during the game).

It helps. Well, either the liquor or the mantra. But one of them is helping.

whetstonebuck said...

Try this: Serenity Now!

Anyway, the black smoke represents the burning of practice schedules over the past three years.

White smoke is the sign that the evidence is ash, the coast is clear, and RR is fired. After that, it's the lollipop scenario as proposed by Yost.

srudoff said...

Those practice schedules were shredded, not burned.

whetstonebuck said...

Shredded--then burned. Michigan knows that the Freep scours the local landfill looking for evidence to be reassembled or sold.

Bigasshammm said...

Is there anything to the report that Jenn Sterger solicited sex from RR? I mean really this couldn't get any weirder.

Bigasshammm said...

I so miss this cartoon....

Ramona said...

Interesting post. Maybe OC was the position he should have been hired into, instead of HC.

Mikoyan said...

Thank you for the original idea. I just added Rich Rod's face and the Free Press banner to make it more relevant.

srudoff said...

officially fired now

ChicagoWolverine said...

It's now official:

whose next? i need this to be over so i can get back to work rather than hitting refresh on all the sport sites :)

Bigasshammm said...

We should hopefully know at 12:30
I'm hopeful that the delay for the firing yesterday was finalizing the new deal with whoever the new guy is.

If Greg Robinson is named the head coach I will drown myself in my toilet.

phil said...

It's official........oh, wait.........SI reports no decision has been made.......no, wait..........yes, it is official ESPN is reporting.......wait......Detroit Free Press refusing to confirm..........oh, hold it.......yes, it is official. Wait......what was the question?

wingedhelmet said...

My apologies to "Looking Glass"
just hum the tune "Brandy"

There is a coach on a western bay
And he gets a hundred offers a day
Disgruntled Alums pass the time a way
And talk about RR's losses

Theres an AD in this harbor town
And he works laying Offers down
They say Brandy fetch another Bo
He serves them Hoke and Miles

The Alumni say...

Brandy you're a fine CEO
What a good AD you would be

Your Skills could steal a coach from the NFL
Brandy wears a braided chain
Made of the finest silver from the North of Spain
A locket that bears the name of the man Brandy wants
He came on a winters day bearing words that pushed the Alums away
But he made it clear he wouldn't stay
The NFL's his new home

The Alumni say...

Brandy you're a fine AD
What a good boss you would be

Your Skills could steal a coach from the NFL

Brandy used to watch his eyes
As he told his gridiron stories
Brandy could feel his fortunes rise
He saw the potential glory
Lord he was a pompous man

And Brandy does his best to understand

At night when the Bowls close down
Brandy Walks through a silent town
And loves a man who is NFL bound
He still can hear him say
He hears him say

Brandy you're a fine AD
What a good boss you would be

Too bad you are left with just Brady and Leslie!

Ramona said...

OK WHelmet that was very well done!

Grants said...

Heard the smoke is white now. Good luck with JH.

Yost said...

Smoke is now white.

PS Phil, that Animal House thing is hilarious. Need to see if I can make a post out of that.

dtw2phx said...

@Bahammm LMAO! re: GR as HC I might have to fight you for who drowns themself first. UGH!! They should've just left his ass in FL after the game.

Andy said...

If Gerg is head coach - I will become a buckeye fan

Andre said...

Ok, I'm hearing espn and this Drew Sharp a complete dumbass. Saying Michigan fans only care about winning the conference and going to the Rose bowl. Is not a national program. What a dork. I think Jim Harbough will not do that much. He blasted the academics players took back when. Les Miles ok, but what about the clock management in games almost blowing leads on stupid plays. Brady H. not as head coach, maybe defense or Ron English at defense. Hell, Im a huge Michigan fan since I was 7 and get pissed cause Im supposed to like Texas, cause I live here. I've been to the Big House twice, seen them here another 2 times and spent money that you wouldn't belive on tickets, shirts, hats, etc... I bleed maize and blue. I know that Dave B. will do us right, just who else is left. I like to see Mike Leah,but I threw that out, cause his defense at tech was not that great either. Whatever happens I'm still a Wolverine till I die. Go Blue!!!!

Mikoyan said...

TEchnically the smoke is still black because they haven't selected a new coach yet.


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Wednesday, November 30, 2011

God spites ref for bad call

Been meaning to say something about this...

Did you notice the bile bursting forth from the ref when he announced they were overturning Fitz Toussaint's TD late in the game?  Everybody I was watching with asked, What the hell was that?

Well, after getting all Zapruder on it, I think a Higher Power was in the process of making the ref's innards purge themselves from his body after such an atrociously bad call.

bnat said...

cough drop...

JamesD'Troy said...

Yeah, I saw that too and thought he was merely coughing up a tic-tac. Now...not so much. That it came at the start of just awful sequence of calls and penalties was interesting. Considering the BCS, NCAA, and the crappy status of college football in general there's lots to be upset about. Perhaps the Football Gods are pissed off after all, they should be.

I guess we'll know for sure if we end up with an all-SEC, game of the 19th Century snoozefest BCS NC game. That and if FUCLA does the impossible and beats the Floats in the P12 CCG to go to the Rose Bowl as the crappiest Rose Bowl team in history as a form of divine embarassment for P12 commish Larry Scott and the rest of the P12.

Andrew said...

WooHoo..congrats Hoke...coach of the year...this was such a good year...many happy Saturdays..

Ramona said...

OMG, is that photoshop skill or real??